I hope you get it sorted out but my point was you don't need any switch with other QSs. They're on all the time and if you don't want to use it, just pull the clutch as you shift like you would without a QS. The PCV QS doesn't work that way?

As far as racing goes, you can miss a gear with a QS and that might cost you more time than using the clutch. They're great but they're not perfect.

Oh well, hope you get this setup going but if not, an HM seems like a good setup.

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Had a very good conversation with Chris from dynojet. He ran me through some tests. This switch is electronic not mechanical so it won't do anything without power. After reading the spec sheet of the actual sensor I see why it didn't work the way i was trying. It takes 10v minimum so the 5v of the PCV wasn't enough. Chris did say after running me through the tests it should work just like K-Factory shows. Now I just need a good 12v source close to left ram air tube. The 3 wires inside the sheath are so small that I really don't want to split it running the 3 wires straight to the battery. What would you use for 12v up there? Any source closer than the city lights.

Thanks

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I raise my phantom flag as I say you are on your own is your unit and your choice to the help on the net.
Computer Tower 5v usb output to turn the pc on w/dead engine/key off.

Read L to R from the wire harness side out to the end of the box.
In 1 = 0.183 + volts
In 1 = - Neg ground.

In 2 = 0.183v+
In 2 = - 0.0v ground.

Speed = 0.17v

Analog = 0.0-v

Crank = 0.0v
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Crank-0v = I am a daisy-chain so I send out a crank signal upon start up? I have yet to test running. I connect to another piglet in the daisy chain to receive a signal, yes" Little miss piggy needs a crank type signal and this provides it. Once the pcv unit is hooked up, it uses a crank signal as you know, so is it hot to ground?

Analog-0v = Note there are no volts as if to say it's grounded. I am going to know if I have volts to it key on/bike running soon.

Speed = 0.17v+ means I'm hot with a gps wire that has to stay hot, not go to ground. I won't kill a spark with this port.

2+2- = Must use as if a wall socket. Here are my two wires from my lamp. I cannot jump from one to the other and use said port 1. I'll get back to this.

1+2- = Must use as a wall socket. You are handcuffed to the numberset-11 numberset-22. I'll follow up or you've got it yet?

______________________________________________________________________
Ports 1+1-:
When I plug in my wire 1+ and wire 1-, am I now just dangling 2 wires out of the pc? Yes. When I connect a toggle, am I not connecting my dangling wires together? Yes. When I say off, I mean dangle, no current or very little, or it's like saying 0 for OFF. And when that toggle connection is being made, is that not a flip to 1 and that says ON in computer speak means connected? Yes.

Ports 2+2-: This is the same exact side of map1 as if to toggle to map2. I close down the one map so the autotune runs the trims and fills in the learning process. So we are not about to kill this map but maybe swap it to the other map? We want to turn it off momentarily so how can killing it swap to the other map if it did work = No kill?

I have all 4 +/- ports open, I run the base map. I install a kill in port2 and a toggle in ports 1. Are not both ports empty as if; no one toggled to the other map. No one shifted a map in the other port... Until both make contact to the +/- pins?

Speed +0.17v: This is to load your 6 individual maps, and this was the one in question that you might be right about, and I think you are. My AFR only knows for sure so my bike is on the rack going thru the motions of; 'when I get off my fat ass' to 'when I get in the mood' kind of not in a hurry. This is my, 'what if?' So this one is a thread in itself. I'll just say that speed is hot with volts.

That said, I want to bring in this kind of k-box. It's one wire out and said to be placed in the variable or a hot wire into the speed port hole when it is hot. Scenario says, we have 5v out of the speed sensor with key on and the pc is showing 5v as with the others you say 'when running.' That's like pouring salt over salt, 5v into 5v, right? No work is speed.

Analog -0.0v: Plug me into a zero volt plug. I will go hot on the other side of the integrated circuit and turn the autotune on when the water temp reaches a preset fahrenheit threshold number. My ground is waiting to be touched. When my water rises, my numbers are sent in so I send in analog (many) and my water is not about to kill a map no way... Not this port.

Crank -0.0v: When I look at this, it says I am sending and receiving a crank signal? Again, unless you farted in the brain, I still have to find out if this goes hot upon start up? So, this one says to call pwcom for the daisy chain info to this. It hooks to one of their other units. OK, then Crank means spark kill. But if this just sends something or you can wrinkle the signal so it won't short but shorts the signal out of range and no spark occurs? Can't make it hot or no start. Have to hook ground but you short out the k-box to the frame? No way!

Got it? I can't flip if I hook up a 2+ to a 1- and think I swapped to the other map or killed the map I'm on. And you know swapping won't help to a 1+ to a 2- is a mirror opposite = no flipping of maps. It has to be a signal to ground kind of wire up to trigger. If I hook up 1- alone, I throw it at ground. If I hook up 2+ into 2- all I did was swap maps momentarily.

Here is my k-box. I hook up two wires and those are to the battery hot and ground the k-box. My 3rd wire out is a hot signal, yes? So if say we took the signal going into the crank signal, it says we have a spark maker and a spark breaker.

So the deal is, I take a resistor of any size and wire the one end to ground. I now start the bike and stab the crank port hole see if this kills the engine with the resistor being a fuse so watch out for the silicone heating up on the finger hold. It should cut that bike like right now or not? Hope it does not. Now, push the shifter kill switch and did the bike run on the hold down? Something like that.

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Wait a minute. You have a k-box that converts down to 5v. and can push out any volt out one of those pins in the IC.

I have to have 12v or more at my 1 and ground my 16 pin. My half moon cutout and my part number facing me is how I know + is pin 1 and so forth. If I have a IC like this, I am fed 12v so I step-down and run 5v or any volt per how the IC is made for said resistance and the ohm's laws that get it there.

So was the problem you wired the k-box with 5 volts or less than 12v? I assumed you have a jobber for a 12v bike and when a red and black wire is used off the battery, it's 12v so the motherboards work under this 5v window for our application.

Battery does not know who is hooked up to whom as they use their own binary numbers for said IC chip design and motherboard setup. Look at the right column that shows two +/- port docking as if looking at the pc port holes and match those.

Look at the ABCD of the binary system and the truth tables needed to gate these things.

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If you don't want to plug into any existing 12v source there are open connections in both of the fuse boxes that you can run wires to from the battey to fuse box and back to the switch. Just use correct fuse size. That way switch is on its on power circuit. Easier to debug if switch failes and doesn't effect any other power sources or other bike functions.

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Blkcasper I do want to tap into an existing 12v as close as possible to where the power commander is on the ram air tube.

Hub,I'm sorry for the confusion I've caused. My original testing methodology was flawed. When DJ Chris ran me through a battery of tests we found out signal wire is a ground. It does not carry an voltage.

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For most integrated circuits to step the volts down, say it takes 12v at pin 1 and grounds to 16.
This is the same as saying CC and DD use the same +DD- kind of port hole [input side] connections on the pc.

Then look at the gates, add up 3 sets of letters looking for that 4th calc of the fixed binary numbers the truth tables follow.

Look at your k-box and how it looks like a gate. Power source to both wires to that one end and then there is the wire back out to find a daisy chain input. See it sort of?

* Last updated by: Hub on 3/3/2015 @ 12:20 AM *

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I was thinking about that in the first post[I started with but aborted it]. Are we hot at the wire or not? So I think I re-asked or walked it a few posts later?. A ground off a jobber is like it's off out of the loop and the battery does not know what is hooked up to it? The battery is a constant 12v say and it has no clue as the volt/reg feeds the demand and keeps it at 12v say is the constant give or take a few 10ths.

Go to the horn and find the +side, key on only, no button needed to be pushed. Wire that to the k-box and ground the box to the frame. Horn and box can both use fuse, but use a fuse in-line and cook that first, not the bike's harness.

* Last updated by: Hub on 3/3/2015 @ 12:25 AM *

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I gotta say it before someone else does so here goes. "This Thread Delivers!"

Hey U, Uguy, I'm glad you had that convo with Chris. I am trying to get to the bottom of this in a basic sort of a way dealing with this computer bike stuff. I am also smacking myself on head and saying, dummy, right in front of you put 2 and 2 together.

This has nothing to do with your conversation, because I have no clue how [I'm sure] interesting it was? But coming back from that conversation made me think E is E is Equal be it A or DC. That's pretty basic.

Hub,I'm sorry for the confusion I've caused.

It's very complex are the moves so it's either on or off is what I was stepping for. You as the internet input, brings in so much info and that is it. Whatever you are doing behind the screen is who knows how you are approaching it so I'm off on that digging there of a whole different way. The need more info is I don't need any, it's your problem to solve. I'm after basic theory and this is one milestone for me. Like, one HUGE clue it's so complex I have yet to complete the steps. Just bits of them and now here you go.

When you said which pin, I lifted the hood and said, something like this 0P400. Look at the layout of the legs to port holes. Not confusing at all so far. Toggle says connect or not to complete a circuit. It's either off or on it's way. Many IC's to calc and recalc. The E of it all in that balance. So as I still have no place to turn for these answers, I am on my own figuring out the simple it's so simple.

The complex is where I'm stepping now. If my own type of theory I make up that I can understand, then so will you. No matter how I explain it, it walks as it talks in the absolute of it I pull out my ACDC card. I wish I could live long enough to look at those ports and say, who needs to pop the hood, that's a Maxwell and it does this and 400 means this and P means that.

But first, I need the bottom line basics and this is how I find it. I think it out and punish you with the obvious clues right smack in front of me. So it says I am questioning my science of junk or not?

My original testing methodology was flawed. When DJ Chris ran me through a battery of tests we found out signal wire is a ground. It does not carry an voltage.

And that is where we chase some sort of method to this madness. I was trying to get you to that point. Next is all that on/off about to happen. Me drilling out the 1 and 0 in the binary, the wall switch lamp connections are so simple. All those methods mean plus to plus and ground to ground. There are only 2 methods, 3 variables and a massive tree root of things that go wrong on the math, the connect, the balance.

So that IC and those legs begin to make sense so you see it in 2's? That's hookup 1 to 1 and 2 with 2 is connect +/- together? The wire out the k-box is 0v waiting for a momentary +. I would hook a dead wire on a dead leg. That says balance in the E of it, yes?

Back to the chip. NC is the crank signal say. It needs to pass onto the next pig part needing a signal for that unit too. Look at V- is plug my 0v wire here. Why? The rest of my legs all balance out. So who is left of the + is not connected and who of the - is not connected, look at the chip. So who is on the other side is a hot side about to be lit up by the last leg to be touched. I flip, I flop to hot.

My k-box looks like a generic look at my gates and T Tables:
1. Are they not holding 3 wires out? Yes
2. Are they not in the basics of 1 and 16 needing a +/- to send the signal out to the one wire? Yes.
3. Are you not dangling 3 basic wires needing a hot/ground/brainfart wire goes where?
4. Are we close in theory that if I hot that wire to the neg peg and it meets +, and are not a few +'s on one side of the chip? And why not run the chip to see a signal on the other side of the chip? And can't you see both legs next to each other that are plus and minus sides? And could you not plus one side over at the V+ and send the other V- is to minus the other side of the chip? An does that still read as connect the dots is how the brain fartsaylot?

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This has gotten so ridiculous it is absolutely funny. I guess K-Factory doesn't know that the water pump is different on the 2012+ 14r, than it is on the 07-11. Reason that is important is the sensor bracket mounts to the water pump. They give you a 6x15mm shcs to replace the 6x55mm flanged bolt as the flange won't fit in the milled bracket. I think even somebody with no math skills might just realize that bolt is way to short. Then the trigger bar which bolts on to the shifter clamp bolt now has to be spaced out .40" to clear the sensor due to the different water pump.

Then it's wired up as Chris and I talked about yesterday. Power for switch to a battery (oem battery sitting on floor) and black signal wire going into port 3. Things looking good. Switch has power, is cycling on and off when triggered. Double check again, no voltage coming through signal wire, just ground. Measure voltage across ports 3 and 4 with switch open, showing 5v just like it should. Trigger the switch and there is 0 voltage between posts 3 and 4, so it's grounded and should trigger kill.

I have kill time set to 1000ms and cycle switch. LED indicator show switch is closed, PCV is grounded. Shouldn't I hear the motor falter? Is it not faltering or dieing since I don't have a load on it. UP here in frozen wasteland Toledo, OH I'm testing by motor running, in gear and on swing arm stand. Would dragging the brake to simulate a load make a difference?

At this point I'm about to do what no man wants to do, admit defeat.

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Sorry I'm of no assistance here. Dragging the brake briefly sounds like a good way to simulate some load but I wouldn't want to do it for more than a few seconds. Also, the chain is running at it's loosest with no weight on the rear wheel. That seems risky to me. Mine made a clunking noise doing that. Maybe it was a kink in the chain but it told me not to run the rear wheel with the swingarm fully open.

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So first, thanks U, U, U son of a gun, Guy! This was one huge brainfart for me ASSwell. Something made so much sense I should have figured it out long ago. It's more like applying the basics. This one wire has me stumped however. I thought Chris might wire it from there?

How about this:
1.When they say if you run a daisy chain, use the lone connector thing they gave you to connect either 1-1+ or +2-2 to complete the circuit of all those daisy connections. Lets see if that forces the ping?

2. We are wired to what? I'm going to wire off of +2 and daisy the -11+ ports together. I am going to take and run any size resistor, screw it into inline -2 and ground that resistor to the frame. My banner is up and I will assume you will not spike the pc so as it is inoperable. The resistor takes the heat as if a blown fuse. The momentary will complete the circuit if we have the k-box ground to the frame too, not in the remote battery out of the ground loop.

3. I am going to pull the dongle kind of connector and remove it. I now am open +11- without accy daisy connector. I still have my combo port 2- is grounded to the frame. The k-box single wire is connected in +2 and 2- is grounded to frame/k-box ground side.

4. Where are my 2 intermittent wires hooked up to? A receptacle at the side of the box or?

Thanks for the cranial purges.

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A far as kill test, I would simply let it idle. I'd manually hold the switch open and if it kills the engine, then it kills as if a remote kill switch. I want to let it run in 3rd at idle, then kill it. That says it is more inline with the crank kill and hold the switch manually open.

I keep forgetting, but I'd make sure I am in program 2map while using port2. I'd reprogram port1 if using the port 1+ hole. Or, simply swap to both 1 and 2 ports with a hold down of the k-wire to a port hole.

* Last updated by: Hub on 3/3/2015 @ 9:39 PM *

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OK I need to be HUB slapped. Again it was the stinking basics that caused 4 days of wasted time.

On my drive to Chicago last night I had another one of those brain farts. This time it was actually a light bulb going off.

When I woke up around 2pm today it was back to the garage before my son got home from school. Triple checked the program to make sure I had everything set up right, it was. QS on input #2, normally open switch, 1000 minimum rpm, 500ms kill time, every thing was right but darn thing not working.

So, let's try something else. Go into program and set QS to input#1 and run a pair of wires into the 2 ports of input 1. start motor, touch 2 wires together and voila, motor dies. OK, input 1 works so let's try 2. Pull out K-factory sensor wire and put the 2 bare wires in. Switch program to input 2 and try again. Motor dies so we know nothing is wrong with the PCV. Try one more experiment. K-factorys wiring diagram shows just 1 wire going into the PCV, into port 3 which is the hot side of input 2. so I start motor again and just touch that wire to a frame bolt and the motor dies. K-factory's diagram was right, and Chris from DJ was right, it should work. So why isn't the switch??

Here's were the light bulb went off last night. It is always the freaking basics. I had tried the ports of input 1 of the pcv but the 5 volts there isn't enough to activate the switch. SOOOOOO, instead of getting my 12v from the motorcycle I simply wired the switch up to the factory battery I had removed to install a lightweight one. It occured to me the PCV was looking for frame or bike ground and even though the switch was functioning it wasn't grounding to bike, it was grounding to the spare battery. So I ran some wires to the license plate light plug and tried again.

Viola, darn thing works. Yea!!!!!!!!! 4 wasted days tinkering with this thing because of my mistake.

I will say it looks as good as it does in their pictures. If you didn't know it was there you aren't going to accidently notice it. But, for what it costs one shouldn't have to go looking for parts to make it mount up. Had a spare 6x20mm (need a 25) laying around to replace the too short 15mm one they sent and looked through my bag of loose odds and ends and found 2 nice spacers to move the trigger arm outward. All is mounted and it works. Did send an email to both K-Factory and Webike Japan letting them know the thing doesn't fit as is due to the 2012+ models having a different water pump.

Thanks for the help and suggestions. Even yours HUb although most of the time I had no idea of what your were trying to say with the IC post info.

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Hoorah hoor-ray! I hate when it's so simple you'd never even think of it.

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Sinusoidal steady state.... U_U_U_U PEE YES you see the GROUND DELIVERY! Sin here! LOL

I just wired it up as if out of the box. Once I saw that, 'my remote battery' and here I am with the 3-Sinusoidals waiting for a number. Now, lets look at the gate. What am I missing from the basics? 4 to make a number. I have my gates hot off a battery. I have one wire left out of the k-box... Sinusoidal.

I have 12v 'out of the gate' like horse is 12v. I work in a 5v pony environment out of the next gate we add more legs off that IC. I am sitting here waiting with 3 wires in the air as if I turned the engine off, the battery still connected kind of 3 wires; until I place a +jobber at it like a key switch, daisy chain + to a light bulb and ground the winker case or the bulb holder is the binary set to read in computer speak. We need to set it to ground- and the 4th gate is a resistor. Why. So we can step down the volts to run a 5v processor so it works by means of a binary system ... Sinusoidal.

"So I was testing my k-box from down the street. Well, you said use a long wire and I spooled out this much...." SAY WATT? The pc is the jobber. It's another jobber-gate hooked up to the same IC +/- power made at that pcv. Daisy chaining is the pig needing a pig's ground to pin's ground is the same as + in its samy daisy chain off the jobber. Jobber is Wire-in-Wire-out. It is the number! Who sent in who's number is the speed/crank speed, etc... Sinusoidal.

I jump right over your wattever you are doing and go right back to the basics. It's the net, so the basics get you there. I grabbed the complex by the short hairs, reversed her engineering. I have nowhere to go but the basics. Why? 'Oh I forgot to tell you 5 pages ago... spool me is spool you! I learned way more than our little 4th variable to close down on a number.

1. I buy a gate. I buy a battery is a gate. I buy a k-box is a gate. I buy a pc, I move [ground or un ground) the gate 2 ways = On or OFF in the speed of light [is your kill switch move].
2. I open the box and there is k-box with a + wire, a - wire, and watt looks like my gate or 3rd wire. They have one basic look to it. It has to gate via 3 ways and has yet to formulate a recognized made number. Ohm's law and those 3 variables call the 4th number to trigger itself to ground if that is what the k-box wire does.
3. I can flip and flop those 3 wires to repeat only 2 moves and it needs a 4th number to enter the correct binary numbers and for this to happen the binary numbers are???... Sinusoidal.

4th Variable. In this case I see watt just happened in the gate INPUT Chris sent you to. It's another way of saying I knocked the kill switch off while riding and flipped it back on. So where does my one wire go? I want to ground my + to ground or, reset my running map; as if I pulled the usb plug and plugged it back in. Only a shithefuckfaster is a done deal digitally like flip me back on in the flop like I missed a milliamp beat?

NOT!

Ivan did... He made

* Last updated by: Hub on 3/4/2015 @ 7:38 PM *

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Hey man can you post a diagram or list what wires went were.
Kinda confused as what went where.
1. What wires plugged into pc5? I assume from drawing red and blue wires went to pc5 input 1 or 2

2. What wires went to power? Middle wire connected pc5 port 3 or connected to 12v power?

3. I would assume switch would be grounded to bike where it mounts to gear cover?

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Happy to do so Blkcasper,

I tried getting the power from ports 1&2 of the power commander but they are only 5 volts. Spec sheet from Koyo shows the sensor needing a minimum of 10v. So I have the brown wire hooked into the + side of the license plate light plug. The blue I have going to the - side of the same license plate light plug. Since the only thing drawing on that plug is a LED light there isn't much current draw on it. The black wire is into port 3 of the PCV. It really is that simple. All the freaking problems are me not realizing powering it with a separate non bike power source was confusing things.

Also remember for the 12+ models (at least on mine) the supplied bracket mounting screw is too short and I had to space out the shifter trigger bar another 15mm. The spacer they sent was only 5mm.

It really is simple and it really is so inconspicuous that nobody will ever realize you have a QS without really looking for the darn thing.

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Buy input 3 of the pc5 do you mean the one labeled " speed" on the pc5 drawing?
Really sounds great as I just recieved my repaired annitori Qs back but this a much easier setup as I dont have to take bike apart to install. May just sell qs4.

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3rd hole from wire bundle if you are using switch 2 for the QS
1st hole from wire bundle if you are using switch 1 for the QS

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