I am new to this bike. This weekend I plan to install a Power Commander 5, Autotune and it has been suggested I remove the secondary butterflies.

I checked the Dynojet website and see maps for removed flies, but none of the available 2008-2011 maps have that option.

Is butterfly removal generally used only for the older models? If not is there a source for maps that may have this option for my 2009?

Thanks much.

06-07 the flies did not open until 6k rpm. Fly removal was a must. On the 08-11, flies open around 3200 rpm. You might never feel that unless you are commuting.

without putting my 08 on a dyno, I can't say removing flies gave it any better power. It did not seem any different at all. After putting in a flies out map, the throttle response was more linear between the flies closed/open range. After one Autotune adjustment, it got a lot better and finally doing a thorough tuning, it is pretty smooth but I still feel a slight surge in power in 1st gear at 3200 if I am on the throttle hard.

No, it is not really necessary to remove the flies on an 09 in the sense that you won't be missing out on any power. I think tuning for flies out will make the bike safer for street riding if you ever take off into a corner somewhat aggressively.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/15/2017 @ 3:21 PM *

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I talked to Nels at 2wheeldynoworks about my 06. He said to not remove my flies. He would change their action with a reflash to get the same benefit.
Less work for me, I like that.

Mad

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Good food for thought. Man I wish we could all have dyno machines in our garages lol....

flies can stay.

Looking over some info I got from Romans a while back, he said it made no difference whether you tuned them or removed them as long as you had the proper mapping for either setup. Smokin had his fastest time on the Gen1 with flies out. I presume there was no pattern of consistently faster quarter mile passes with flies out or Romans would be suggesting everyone remove flies on the Gen1 06 through 11.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/15/2017 @ 3:27 PM *

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I emailed DynoJet because they have different maps for the older ZX14s but not my generation. I asked them why and their response was that there is little change with the butterflies in or out for my year bike, and that using one of their maps that doesn't state "butterflies removed" is fine.

If you go with Autotune, you can see how fine it is with the AFR gauge. Dj maps are probably pretty conservative in subtracting fuel. I just had lengthy conversations with a guy who was not thrilled with the performance of his Dj 06-07 ZX-14 full system Yoshi map in his 08-11 ZX-14. He felt the stock fueling was better. A Dj map would be a fine place to start if it's a dog, you Autotune it.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/17/2017 @ 3:41 PM *

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Looking over some info I got from Romans a while back, he said it made no difference whether you tuned them or removed them as long as you had the proper mapping for either setup. Smokin had his fastest time on the Gen1 with flies out. I presume there was no pattern of consistently faster quarter mile passes with flies out or Romans would be suggesting everyone remove flies on the Gen1 06 through 11.

For the guys just starting out showing them how to enjoy performance gains while saving some money is always my first approach. Especially if you don't have allot of spare cash lying around. Removing the secondary throttle plates is a great Mod and it's Free. Some small mechanical skills required. Lots of info here on the forum on how to do it. 20006,07 Gen1 guys have the most to gain. But "ALL" model years of the ZX14 enjoy the increased throttle response.

From here look into sprocket changes. All great starting mods that don't break the bank. Still want more ? Then we go Flash PCV, turbo, NOS etc. Skies the limit and beware of those staring at your wallet.

I emailed DynoJet because they have different maps for the older ZX14s but not my generation. I asked them why and their response was that there is little change with the butterflies in or out for my year bike, and that using one of their maps that doesn't state "butterflies removed" is fine

Fine ? Please keep in mind I have had many guys show up here running the "Older" maps even older ECU's. Although their bikes ran fine I would have to say they were going the wrong direction. The early Gen1 ran 440cc injectors. Your model year uses 330cc injectors. Fuel Mapping is not the same. Works yes but without know your bikes AFR and elevation "Fine" sounds vague.

If you want to see all Secondary plate maps just let me know and I will post them for you. Also the fuel maps for the different model years. I will help where I can Cheers

Rick

Good to hear from you Romans. I know a couple people who were screaming for you. Did my best to answer questions. We couldn't get you by email. Know a guy who is willing to pay you for it ...that was the guy who was using the 06-07 map in his 09. He said the Dj flies out 06-07 map was noticeably worse than stock fueling on his 09. It worked but the bike was not as strong. Told him your map looks a lot leaner at 100% TP than his on top and somewhat richer in the midrange. Also leaner at very low rpm where we don't normally ride. Of course, this is all subject to the Target AFR tables of each map which I would not divulge even if I compared them. I'm not giving out your Gen1 map unless you say that's ok. Sent him my Tsukigi map.

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I wouldn't mind seeing whatever map info you would like to share. I am learning that personal maps are much like ammunition reloading recipes and as such often closely held secrets, but if you are ok sharing then I am ok trying!

I had an '08 and could lock the subs open. I felt no difference. The complaint was back with the first 2 years. Very dangerous for passing. Once the flies removed, it ran like the rest of the gens. They simply changed the opening rate of the subthrottle to match the main throttle's opening rate. Dyno shows a loss of HP. That means a linear loss heading up that rpm range. Leave them in... runs smoother with them in.

Pull the air cleaner. Left side main frame. Aluminum plate with arrow direction noted. Slide the filter out and note how dirty it is. If the book says to replace every so and so miles, I cut that interval in half and replace it then. Then, I take a straight edge razor and cut the 4 melted plastic buttons off and pull the steel screen... runs smoother with the sneeze screen removed.

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I wouldn't mind seeing whatever map info you would like to share.

That's up to da man. Looking at a PM from Romans, he did not want me to post a pic of his map. He would probably not send every person the same map he sent me because of altitude differences, mods, etc. Just a hit and miss share of a map can lead to misunderstandings. Anyway, it's his personal intellectual property so I can't give it out. It is nice, the decel pops are less and it does have some extra midrange power. I prefer Romans map to my first refinements of it with Autotune. I used a single AFR # in my table and Romans has many. I am sure that is the reason his is somewhat better in some ways. I'll get it ironed out perfect eventually though. The previous map wasn't bad either though. LOL I'm a perfectionist. I am not the guy to turn to if you want to hear this mod or that TRANSFORMS the bike. Romans even says the stock 14 is already such a great bike it is hard to make it worlds better. The gearing will make a change. 17F / 45R will still get the Gen 1 past 186....it is really no dif than downshifting though-----very similar sensation to be honest. A quickshifter is a very exciting mod that changes the riding experience. Air filters----hahahahha--I wouldn't bother. Not as safe and no real hp gain.

Plan to boost someday. That will pucker your butt again after you get used to the stock power. i have a NOS project started. I really think i will turbo on top of that just be a badass.

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Well I got the PCV installed today. Getting it under the seat like I wanted was a BEAR.

Waiting for a cable and plug for the Autotune, but I plan on welding in the sensor and running the wiring tomorrow.

I used a map downloaded from Dyno today. Not a huge difference noticed but there was a lot more low end.