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Thread: M7 RRs vs Q3s

Created on: 05/03/15 05:53 AM

Replies: 8

VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2361

M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/03/15 5:53 AM

I currently have Q3s on my bike and like them overall better than the stock M5s. Turn in is much quicker, steering is lighter, which is what I want. However, one area that's not great is the wear. They've been installed 2050 miles, at most I have 400-500 miles on them at this point. The M5s in contrast, lasted 4400 miles before hitting the wear bars.

The Great 50 vs. 55 Debate
One of the thing that bothers me about how most people approach this issue is they switch from an OE 50 series sport touring tire to a 55 series performance tire and then exclaim how different things are. But there's a side of this debate that most people do not understand. All 190/50 17 (or whaever size) tires are not the same. Even if the tread width is 190mm, the profile of the tread area varies tire to tire. Sport tires like the Q3 have a different shape than something like M5s.

You've all seen this image. This image is so misleading it's ridiculous, and only represents the most generic concept of the difference in tire sizes. It's vital for you to understand that not every tire has the same shape unlike what is portrayed in this literal piece of garbage.

Most of you have not seen this image. This image represents the reality of how different tires of the same size can be different. This is an actual comparison between two same size tires with different tread profiles. This is where the rubber meets the road. In this case, this compares actual profiles of the M5 vs. M7RR. This is evidence, this is proof, this is information.

Why do 55's make a difference then, Vic?
The reality is you're changing the steering geometry, it's not from the shape of the tire's tread profile. You're decreasing rake probably ~1 degree by going from a 50 to 55. Same thing as many people know as raising the forks 10mm or so. It's ever so slightly decreasing stability of the bike. The better solution is probably raising the forks though, as this also would slightly decrease the wheelbase (maybe .25").

M7 RR vs. Q3
So now that you all understand a little more about how actual tread profiles work, here's some pics of my two sets of tires. Note, they are not mounted/aired up. However I would say it's safe to make some comparison even if that's the case.

Overall both sets of tires have very similar shapes. These are both the same size, 120/70 17 (f) and 190/50 17 (r) I'm confident in terms of turn in and steering effort they will perform similarly.

Front
M7 RR - Sitting side by side, it's clear although very similar the profile of the M7 RR front is slightly more oval than the Q3 front. I expect this tire could even seem a little more agile in terms of turn in and lightness.

Q3 - what can I say? I like everything about it that everyone else does. But even in these pictures you can visually see the profile is slightly more round on the Q3 vs. M7 RR


Rear

M7 RR - Sitting side by side, it's clear although very similar the profile of the M7 RR rear is slightly less oval than the Q3. I suspect this is just to counter balance the slightly more radical profile of the front tire?

Q3 - Even in these pics the difference visually stands out, the Q3's rear is slightly more oval. The profiles are very similar though and I think overall the set's will have very similar handling characteristics. Could an ultimate flickable set of tire's consist of the more radical M7 RR front and Q3 rear?


* Last updated by: VicThing on 5/3/2015 @ 6:10 AM *

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hagrid


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Location: pittsburgh

Joined: 02/16/12

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RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/03/15 6:38 AM

Will the profile change any once mounted and inflated?



Yoshis!! GO NINJEE!!!

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2361

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/03/15 8:26 AM

I'd call it just as valid as any of the butt dyno bullshit people post about.


* Last updated by: VicThing on 5/3/2015 @ 8:32 AM *

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Bopropucope


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Joined: 08/01/13

Posts: 285

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/03/15 4:30 PM

"I'd call it just as valid as any of the butt dyno bullshit people post about."


* Last updated by: Bopropucope on 5/3/2015 @ 4:30 PM *

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danfzx14


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Location: NH

Joined: 02/02/11

Posts: 120

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/06/15 8:03 AM

Just swapped over to the M7 RR at the beginning of this season from the now discontinued michelin power pures and initially I have been very pleased so far. Steering seems a bit quicker but very stable when holding a line and its very easy to change line mid comer. So far grip seems on par with the pures, which was excellent.


* Last updated by: danfzx14 on 5/6/2015 @ 8:04 AM *



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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2361

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/08/15 1:20 AM

Dan I'm looking forward to my M7s. I don't foresee any significant decrease on grip compared to the M3s, and I think the positive things I like most about the Q3s the M7s will have. I considered PP, but thought the M7s sounded more like what I wanted. I might eventually try Mich PP4s.

At this point I'm guessing I have 200-300 miles on my Q3s left. I also have my 7500 mile service coming up, so I'll probably do the service and tire swap at the same time.

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cruderudy


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Location: AMR

Joined: 08/15/12

Posts: 1963

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/15/15 6:54 PM

The M7 tread pattern looks like an all weather tire and the Q3 look like a hyper-sport dry (dryer??) tire. I considered the Q3 but bought a set of PP 2CT cause I really liked em on my '06. Had the Brigestone S20R slide a bit at the corner apex at the track, dont know it it was traction control off and drive off the apex or the tire? I could hammer it in T1 but had to be mindefull of the torque with it off.

So is the M7 in the same performance family as the Q3? Q3's got high marks in the latest sport tire shootout at Willow Springs.



Perfectly Set up '06 dead and gone
New BBW '14 14R

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2361

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/16/15 8:43 PM

I personally would put them in a similar class, although technically I think the Q3 is a super sport tire and the M7RR is a sport/sport touring tire. The thing about tire classes is basically it's up to the manufacturer where they fall. If you look at Dunlops RS 2, which is their sport touring tire...is that really a comparison to even an M5 let alone an M7RR?

Both are high performance street tires, both capable of performing well on the the track. Considering how well the (generally disliked) M5 held up in lap times to Q3s I'm sure the M7RR will be quite a good tire.

As far as the sipes, I wouldn't read too much into the differences in patterns. Just different engineering how to solve particular problems. If you compare an M7RR to an M3 (which is a Metzeler super sport tire) the sipes are very similar in design.

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2361

RE: M7 RRs vs Q3s
05/24/15 7:10 PM

Uninstalled my used up Q3s and installed my shiny new M7RRs today


Cleaned up and finished with front

Rear removed

Dirty sprocket @7905 miles

7905 mile sprocket (upper) vs. new (lower)(< 5 miles "from 0 mile bike")

zoomed 7905 mile sprocket (upper) vs. new (lower)(< 5 miles "from 0 mile bike")

Rear done after clean up

Look for a review shortly!

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